Wikidata:Property proposal/Port Letter
port letter
editOriginally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control
Not done
Description | letter(s) used to identify the home port of a boat |
---|---|
Represents | Port letter (Q12311103) |
Data type | String |
Example 1 | Portsmouth (Q72259) → P |
Example 2 | Padstow (Q943931) → PW |
Example 3 | Fukushima Prefecture (Q71707) → FS |
Example 4 | Tangelle Fisheries District, Sri Lanka (no item as yet) → TLE |
Source | http://www.mariners-l.co.uk/portletters.html, http://www.wildmuir.co.uk/fish/fishingports.htm, https://www.findafishingboat.com/article/fishing-boat-registration-letters |
Number of IDs in source | >500 in Europe alone |
Expected completeness | eventually complete (Q21873974) |
See also | licence plate code (P395): distinguishing signs or parts of license plate associated with the subject. For countries: international licence plate country code or distinguishing sign of vehicles |
Single-value constraint | no |
Distinct-values constraint | no |
Wikidata project | WikiProject Ships (Q10782171) |
Motivation
editBoats are allocated a port letter and number (Port letter (Q12311103)); the letter component (which my actually be more than one letter; see examples) identifies the port. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
Discussion
edit- Question Is external identifier the correct datatype for this property? As the Port Letters are not unique, it will not be possible to unambigiously identify a port using this property and therefore string datatype might be more appropriate. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 21:45, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
- @Sic19: Are they not unique? Do you have an example? If there are duplicates, then it might better to split them into, "European PL", "Japanese PL", or whatever. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:55, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing: AB could be either Aberystwyth or Bensersiel, for example. It looks like the combination of letters and country (or probably flag when applied to fishing vessels) might be unique - however, that is based on a quick look rather than proper analysis. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 15:10, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- In that casei, I think this property should be for "European Port Letter", and we can have others for different regions or schemes. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:49, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing: Not sure it's necessary to split by region. Based on another Port Registration Letters website, the unique country and letters combination rule seems to apply worldwide. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 21:08, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
- In that casei, I think this property should be for "European Port Letter", and we can have others for different regions or schemes. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 18:49, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing: AB could be either Aberystwyth or Bensersiel, for example. It looks like the combination of letters and country (or probably flag when applied to fishing vessels) might be unique - however, that is based on a quick look rather than proper analysis. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 15:10, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- @Sic19: Are they not unique? Do you have an example? If there are duplicates, then it might better to split them into, "European PL", "Japanese PL", or whatever. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:55, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- Support as string datatype.
Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 21:45, 29 December 2020 (UTC)Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 21:08, 7 January 2021 (UTC) - @Sic19, Pigsonthewing: can we have a label and a description? ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 23:40, 29 December 2020 (UTC)
- Sorry I missed that; seems Simon has kindly beaten em to it. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:55, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- Why is this capitalized? Is it really a proper name? ChristianKl ❪✉❫ 15:16, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- Sorry I missed that; seems Simon has kindly beaten em to it. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:55, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
- No, my mistake, I've changed it to lowercase. Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 07:21, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
- There seems to be an unresolved problem with the datatype, even when limited to European. For similar, see licence plate code (P395) that uses string datatype. --- Jura 19:30, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
- Support However @Pigsonthewing:, there's some more complex structure for some ports, eg see below. How can we account for that? --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 16:26, 14 January 2021 (UTC)
AA – nnn - ØM Østre Moland
Please weigh in on Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Ships#Home/Registry_Port_vs_City/Country
- Support, an important property for the economy.--Arbnos (talk) 22:15, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing, Sic19, ChristianKl, Jura1, Vladimir Alexiev: @Arbnos: It has been shown that external-id is probably the wrong identifier as Port Letters aren’t unique, not even within Europe. As there is support for the property itself, I would create it with a
String
datatype. Any objections? --Emu (talk) 19:54, 3 June 2021 (UTC)- @Emu: string datatype makes sense to me. Just a small question concerning scope - is the property for European or international ports? The label suggests the former and examples imply the latter. I think it's international but it would be good to clarify and avoid a misunderstanding. All the best, Simon Cobb (User:Sic19 ; talk page) 20:49, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
- Support Pmt (talk) 01:41, 4 November 2021 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing, Sic19, ChristianKl: @Vladimir Alexiev, Jura1, Arbnos, Emu: I have modified the proposed label and datatype based on the above discussion. If there are no objections I believe this is ready to be created. ArthurPSmith (talk) 17:39, 4 November 2021 (UTC)
- Support, Notified participants of WikiProject Authority control — MasterRus21thCentury (talk) 06:39, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
Notified participants of WikiProject Ships @Pigsonthewing:
- Comment IMHO this is not yet ready to create because of several issues. Do we have any Wikiproject Ships expert in the house? Please comment per item below --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 12:43, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
- As I wrote above, there is extra structure in port letters, see http://www.wildmuir.co.uk/fish/fishingports.htm. If I understand correctly, a bigger port (or port area) (eg AA Aust-Agder, Norway) has not only a prefix, but each port in the area has a suffix (eg ØM Ostre Moland). So how should we represent the port letters for Ostre Moland? Maybe AA$1ØM where $1 shows where the boat's "serial number" is inserted? I personally prefer something more visually appealing for the placeholder, eg underscore: AA_ØM
- Another example: FIN _ U Uusimaa
- We need to figure out letter case and what punctuation is allowed and set a regex, eg
St.VC: St. Valery en Caux: dot and lowercase letter AL – 1 – nnn: Tarifa: dash and digit. But is this written AL-1-nnn or AL1nnn?
- I set "distinct values constraint = no" because the letters are not distinct even within one country, eg
AL: Leer, Germany AL: Langeoog, Germany
- I set "single value constraint = no" because of possible variations in script and capitalization. Eg:
- Byala, Bulgaria: "Port letters on Bulgarian fishing boats are in Cyrillic script and will appear on the boat as Бл or sometimes as БΛ (whereas) BL is the nearest Latin script equivalent"
- Nakhodka, Russia: ND and "appears on boat as Cyrillic letters НД"
- What should be the domain of this property? See Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Ships#Home/Registry_Port_vs_City/Country
- (I added "Wikidata project")
- (I added two more sources from the Wikipedia page)
– The preceding unsigned comment was added by Vladimir Alexiev (talk • contribs).
- @Vladimir Alexiev: you might want to draft and new alternative proposal. --- Jura 15:02, 2 January 2022 (UTC)
- Not done next time, please formulate a clear proposal addressing problems raised here. --- Jura 09:41, 22 January 2022 (UTC)