Talk:Challenge coin

Older discussion

An article by a USMC Corporal (citation #1) can not be regarded as definitive on the origins of the challenge coin tradition, especially since he cites e-mails which were "passed on through the network of senior enlisted Marines." I have also heard origins including Vietnam special ops and British officers "palming" medals to their enlisted subordinates. Does anyone know of more definitive references about the history?

The rule of rewarding the "senior" coin present at a challenge is not recognized by any unit I have served with, including 60th AMW, 100th ARW, or 940th ARW (all USAF units). I added a sentence explaining there can be varying rules, and added this rule to the list of variants. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.6.3.10 (talk) 19:59, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

I've added an image of a USMC birthday celebration coin. It's not technically a challenge coin (too big and heavy for flipping like a quarter) but the heads side design is nearly identical to that of USMC challenge coins, they invariably have the eagle, globe & anchor. On the tails side, they usually have the logo of the unit. They are small enough to flip, but that size also provides difficulties for photographers without the equipment or skill for miniature work. Del arte 22:08, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Challenge coins seem to be coming more widely known in the 'non-military' world. I had first heard about them on the The History Channel's Mail Call show, and know that the show's host R. Lee Ermey has created a challenge coin for the show he gives to military personal. At the recent Boy Scout Jamboree, the LDS Church had a challenge coin they had as a give away item. --emb021

I read in a Challenge Coin Association message board that Ermey is passing out Glock challenge coins now. View thread --JAYMEDINC 14:43, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

My MCT coin was in roughly the shape of a dogtag, including the hole at the top, but much thicker. --Johnny (Cuervo) 08:12, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

I've got an Airforce OSI challenge coin, and a United States Secret Service challenge coin if anyone wants pictures of them for the page post something to my talk page... --Michael Lynn 09:07, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

I think the WWI origin of the "challenge coin" likely bogus--the oldest known challenge coins date from the Korean war and this mythical "Army Air Service" coin has never been sited. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.86.116.211 (talk) 18:25, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

The origin of Challenge Coins should be rewritten, because the popular WWI story is a myth. At least it has nothing to back it up. I believe this article should be written similar to how the history of Disc golf was written.--JAYMEDINC (talk) 13:45, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

The whole history is bogus. I never came across them in my service. Can anyone here provide a personal account of seeing one before 1990? I thought not. GCW50 (talk) 15:30, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

I saw a challenge coin at the Armed Forces History Museum in Largo, FL. That coin was OLD and was listed as "Challenge coin from World War I." The "bogus" story was also there as well. Sadly since just about EVERYONE from that War is now gone we will never know the true origins. Needless to say that museum had one from that period, there may be a kernel of truth in that story. I also still have my great grand fathers one from World War II have no idea what it is, all in French and super worn and I have one from an elder Vietnam veteran Marine that has FLYING TIGERS on the head side and the 10th Army Air force on the back. He got it from his NCOIC (he was a WWII/KOREA veteran) who got it during a "bar challenge" from a veteran airmen that was with the Tigers. Needless to say there are a lot of examples out there from prior to the "accepted" time period. Lets face it there are lots of military tradition with "bogus stories," Like my Mameluke sword and the history the Marine Corps accepts as actual and every one else calling it "bogus..." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.234.124.189 (talk) 06:18, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

17th Infantry Regiment "Buffalo Nickel"

I think this may be the true origin of the "challenge coin". The 17th Infantry Regiment adopted the buffalo as their symbol and began a tradition of challenging each other if they had a "Buffalo nickel". As far as I can tell these are the earliest known challenge coins.

Interesting info here: http://www.7thinfantry.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=95 http://www.coincommunity.com/forum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=10256 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._17th_Infantry_Regiment http://www.gotrain.org/~emgeer/coins.html

It would be great if somebody could verify this..

--SRW —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.86.116.211 (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

There has been research on this and much discussion, in an eBay Groups message thread [1]. You must be a member to view. --JAYMEDINC (talk) 03:19, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

United States Air Force

This entire section appears to be the section author's personal statement on challenge coins in USAF. It's an interesting section, and about half of it looks like it should exist in a handbook (which should be cited as the source). But as it stands, the author is his own primary source, which looks like a clear case of original research. Stationary (talk) 21:09, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I have adopted the main page for the USAF Airmans Challenge coin, and I envision a link here once I get the article out of stub status, but this section should be removed until then. Any thoughts? Stevejsam (talk) 12:28, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

"Every Airman receives the Airman's coin upon graduation from Basic Training.[6]"

This must be new because i was in the AF from 94 to 98 and never heard of such a thing. Before that and since then i've been around Air Force people all my life and never heard of this.

i did get a squadron coin after tech school, but no coin during Basic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 161.253.147.34 (talk) 13:43, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

I've moved the sentence about the Airman's coin, as it was the only thing in the section that had a citation , and deleted the uncited remainder of the section (there was another reference in the section, but it linked to an image of a bulldog coin; relevant, but it didn't support the statements it was a reference [i]for[/i]). 11 months is quite long enough for a WP:OR warning, I think. Stationary (talk) 19:14, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

PHOTO of the COIN that President Obama placed at the marker of each Fallen Soldier at Ft. Hood

Photo of coin (front and back) here: http://thisweekwithbarackobama.blogspot.com/2009/11/presidents-coin-placed-at-marker-of.html Perhaps someone could add a link to the photo to the article? LeahBethM (talk) 09:40, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Presidential Challenge coins

Here's a link to George W Bush's "Challenge Coin." http://www.flickr.com/photos/93563538@N00/478519095/in/photostream/

It's funny I've never heard to this tradition until now. How many presidents have had challenge coins made? Since the tradition started less than 100 years ago, it can't be very many. I would like to see a page dedicated to this, with pictures of each president's coin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.232.5.217 (talk) 21:22, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Here's a link to a photo of President Clinton's 'Challenge Coin' http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/578/9dbed80b66961a208aa8d62.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by LeahBethM (talk • contribs) 20:55, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Here's a video of president Obama appearing to deliver a challenge coin and getting one back. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7VVLKVYr3Q --Marc Kupper|talk 09:30, 10 May 2011 (UTC)

Cleanup

A link to Challenge Coin Company Comparison was removed because it was a ploy by the site's owner to direct traffic to his own coin sales site. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.36.251.192 (talk) 20:39, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I reverted an external link in the body that was poorly formatted and made no sense. It was tagged as a "minor edit" and then described as "important info". Please let me know if I have made a WP:Faux Pas by reverting this page. Fliponymous (talk) 23:55, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

You did the right thing, that external link was spam. The only use was to try to sell coins. It did not belong in the article. ~~ GB fan ~~ ^talk 00:07, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

501st Legion

The 501st Legion is an actual fan organization, but there is no indication on their website (or other resources) that they are involved with challenge coins.--S. Rich 16:27, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Stealing coins

I have removed a new section on stealing coins. The section was completely unsourced and was written as a howto manual. The rules presented in the section are most likely a specific units rules and not something that is widely done. I for one have never heard of this before. thoughts? ~~ GB fan ~~ ^talk 07:08, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

Multiple issues

OK, the section on the history of the coins is deplorable. Virtually no citations. And the whole piece about "special forces carrying pfennigs" is pure buntkiss. I lived in Stuttgart for 3 years with army from 84-87, and Pfennig Checks were standard fare by the time I arrived and had absolutely nothing to do with special forces. In fact, the story I was told when I got there was that pfennig checks were a German Custom. It was in no way shape or size a way to identify special forces---in fact, base civilians and dependents carried pfennig's just in case.38.100.76.228 (talk) 21:56, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Missing image?

The bit about the Canadian engineering branch has a "see image" note that doesn't seem to indicate anything. Anyone know why? Pat (talk) 01:25, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Ranking

Ranking refers to the level of the unit that issued the coin. In other words, regiment < brigade < division, etc. In theory, the highest possible rank would be a coin issued by NCA (the President). So, let's say that I challenge with a 502nd Regiment coin, and my buddy pulls out a 101st Division coin--I lose, and have to buy the next round. The unit name inscribed on the coin is considered the issuing unit. I leave it to the smarter people to turn this into an easy-to-understand passage in the article. --ArchangelM127, 1/7/2013

(I lack the proper phrasing to apply to the article as well, Archangel) The information you just provided directly contradicts that currently presented in the article. I suspect this is due to another instance of differing rules within differing group. Do you have a citable source for your set of rules? It would be helpful for whomever writes the copy. The chief problematic section on this subtopic occures in the section "Challenging." After the mention of "ranking" there is a note saying "[clarification needed]," this appears to be a misunderstanding, as the next few sentences provide an explanation of ranking. Unfortunately, those sentences lack a source. The [tag] calling for clarification is probably a mistake or an artifact from an earlier revision, that tag should be removed and replaced with a call for "[citation needed]" after the clarification that is indeed present. Perhapse this alternate method of determining rank could be integrated there? Both methods desperately need a citable source, one acceptable to the Wikipedia guidelines. We should not leave unverifiable personal authority or independent research, only sources that a reader can fact check themselves. 71.235.31.212 (talk) 18:56, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

External links section

In following this article I see the EL section used from time to time by various spammers. So far no legitimate external link has been posted. Rather than leave the section, empty, I've removed it. If we can get a real and worthwhile EL, then I think we can add it. Until then, it's best to omit the section and thereby (hopefully) discourage spamming. – S. Rich (talk) 19:15, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Challenge Coins in the Navy

I served in the U.S. Navy from 1964 to 1994. During that time I never saw or heard of anything referred to as a challenge coin. There was no mention of them in either the Navy Times or All Hands. The closest thing we had were Zippo brand cigarette lighters with the ship's insignia on them. The first time I actually saw a Navy challenge coin was around 2005 at the Naval Medical Center San Diego where they were being sold to raise money for a command event. I notice that the manufacturers are now offering for sale challenge coins for ships and stations decommissioned forty years ago and earlier. I also notice that you can buy a challenge coin with your rank on it. Oldbubblehead (talk) 03:01, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion:

• IGEM-challenge coin-2016.jpg

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 03:37, 14 August 2018 (UTC)

Medallions

In the examples of civilian organisation "challenge coins", are they actually described/used by the org as "challenge coins" or are they just medallions? -- PaulxSA (talk) 14:54, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Pay Walls

Why are footnote references behind pay walls?Linkato1 (talk) 15:18, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Ranking

Ranking has been happening for a long time. The listing “challenges not outside the unit is not recommended” what? Sounds like someone is trying to dampen this down or constrain the page. Maybe you need a ranking page separate from the challenge coin page for people with coins in the real world. 2605:B100:70D:F0AC:FD77:48A5:164F:D07 (talk) 12:58, 17 May 2022 (UTC)