Talk:Connemara

2004/2005 edits

More info in Irish and Italian articles. Needs translation. zoney ♣ talk 01:22, 11 Nov 2004 (UTC)

They both say the same as this, though the Italian version has less on the history and more on the geography and landscape. There is a good article on Omey Island, which I'll have a go at translating (very loosely!). --Red King 21:12, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Tourist info

In the course of a useful factual update, user at 213.202.139.211 removed my 'grand tour'. I accept that this was correct as it was out of scope. --Red King 20:47, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Definition of Conamara

An excellent posting. However living in what is considered today to be the Easternmost part of Conamara, I would suggest a different definition of Conamara. In Irish we say Muintir Chonamara, meaning a person who is from the physical and cultural place we know of as Conamara, roughly from Bearna, west to Cleggan, and north to Dúiche Seoighe. This concept of identity is very strong, whether at home or as emigrants in the UK or US. How can we be so wrong about our sense of self? Surely things change. Perhaps with the expansion of Galway City to the West, the commonly held conception of the boundary will also change. To say to someone from Leitir Móir that thay are not from Conamara is absurd.

Some versus Others

In general, citations are an excellent idea, but when there are issues such as the boundary of a territory without a legal definition, perhaps we should not be too uptight about references. A single reference that the definition is vague would suffice. As the article reads now, the repetitive calls for reference are a bit annoying. We get it; the boundaries are not clear. (In my own case, ask a Californian the difference between northern and southern. I've heard folks say SF is NOT northern; other say that Santa Barbara is.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.124.25.82 (talk) 06:00, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Quite agree, so I've removed all but the first couple. The point is made and doesn't need this repetition, which is to the detriment of the article. Dave.Dunford (talk) 10:14, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Popular culture: The Pendragon Legend by Antal Szerb

Antal Szerb's The Pendragon Legend features George Maloney, a Connemaran character who is fiercely proud of his identity and keeps telling the tallest tales of how Connemaran people are superior to anyone else in the world. He keeps going on about his exploits around the world (not unlike Münchhausen), and always attributes his prowess to the fact that he comes from Connemara.
--195.56.53.118 13:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

Joyce country redirect?

Green indicates Joyce Country, with pale green showing it at it's greatest defined extent, Red indicates Connemara, with pink showing it at it's greatest defined extent (not including those who consider anywhere west of the Corrib to be in Connemara)

Joyce country redirects to Connemara on wikipedia. This is a little misleading as the two locations are separate and distinct areas of Ireland. Joyce country is not a part of Connemara but borders it to the north east. Connemara is situated exclusively in County Galway, but Joyce Country is situated on the north west shores of Lough Corrib and extends into County Mayo. It is bordered on the south west and west by the Maumturk mountains, on the south and south west by Lough Corrib, on the east it extends as far as Cong or Cross depending on the definition, on the north west by Lough Mask, and on the north by the Partry Mountains and Killary Harbour. I suggest that the redirect be removed from the Connemara article. --MacTire02 (talk) 11:08, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Hatnote mention of the Connemara whisky brand

Off-Wikipedia, I was reading an article today about Irish whiskey, and found some commentary about a notable brand called Connemara. It's quite interesting, since it's a double-distilled peated single malt. Peated whiskey (and single malt whiskey and twice-distilled whiskey) is more commonly associated with Scotch whisky than Irish whiskey. Apparently, Connemara is the most notable brand of Irish whiskey that is peated – and possibly the only one. (It's the only one mentioned in the Whisky and Irish whiskey articles, for example.) Anyhow, I was intrigued enough to look it up on Wikipedia and found that the Connemara article isn't about whiskey; it's about a place. That's fine, of course – perhaps the place is more well known than the whiskey. But then I was stuck. The article doesn't mention the whiskey at all. I eventually figured out that the whiskey is actually discussed on Wikipedia in an article about the distillery that produces it. So I came back to the Connemara article and added some guidance to the hatnote so that the next person who looked for the whiskey using its name would learn where to find information about it. My hatnote addition was reverted within 15 minutes (by The Banner), on the grounds of being "promotional". I personally think it was more informational than promotional – I've never tasted that whiskey and I really don't know whether I would recommend it to anyone or not – I just wanted to help people figure out where to find information about it. Per WP:DAB, I think it is entirely appropriate to disambiguate the name of the whiskey from the name of the place. Unless there is some additional rapid objection here, I will add that information back into the hatnote. (The other aspect of my edit was clearly misguided; I won't repeat that.) —BarrelProof (talk) 19:42, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

It would be different when the whiskey had its own article, proving its notability. But this hatnote point to the distillery. The Banner talk 19:50, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

If you take a look at WP:DAB, you will see that disambiguation applies to topics, not article names. As it says, "Disambiguation in Wikipedia is the process of resolving the conflicts that arise when a single term is ambiguous—when it refers to more than one topic covered by Wikipedia. (A 'topic covered by Wikipedia' is either the main subject of an article, or a minor subject covered by an article in addition to the article's main subject.)" A topic doesn't need to have a separate article to be considered in need of disambiguation.

The brand is obviously notable, as I encountered a discussion of it while reading an off-Wikipedia reliable source (link provided above), and many other sources that discuss it are easily found in a quick web search (e.g., [1], [2], [3], [4]).

—BarrelProof (talk) 20:09, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

Then write the article. The Banner talk 20:31, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

If you take a look at WP:DAB, you will see that disambiguation applies to topics, not article names. No additional article is necessary, as a matter of policy, and we shouldn't be creating articles just so they can be dab targets. —BarrelProof (talk) 20:37, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

I think the link can be more properly made at the section Connemara#Other uses. The use at the hatnote for a minor brand appears 'undue'. RashersTierney (talk) 08:55, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

I suppose we are overdue for creating a Connemara (disambiguation) page, as there are four alternative candidate topics already listed in that section, which doesn't even include the pony or the whiskey. Then the hatnote should point to that disambiguation page. —BarrelProof (talk) 13:28, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

If that approach is taken (which already appears to have been put into effect), then per WP:HNS, the hat should be modified to produce This article is about the district in the west of Ireland. For other uses of the term, see Connemara (disambiguation). RashersTierney (talk) 14:21, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

I have implemented that suggestion (also adding the alternative spelling, since it is used for Conamara Chaos). —BarrelProof (talk) 18:42, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Map of area within country

I'm not familiar with Irish geography, could someone add a map showing where Connemara is within the whole country, rather than just its relation to Joyce. MidlandLinda (talk) 19:30, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

@MidlandLinda: Hi,
As it is not formally defined area, I am not sure if a political map can be added here. But I moved around some images that were available in the article already. I hope it works out. —usernamekiran(talk) 20:16, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for the prompt solution. I can place it now. The only part of Ireland I have any familiarity with is North Mayo. MidlandLinda (talk) 20:33, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I agree that the top right of the article should have a box that contains Ireland with a rectangle that shows where Connemara is. Under it, Connemara should follow. From what I see MidlandLinda promised to help out but I do not see an update.

ICE77 (talk) 03:55, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

Term is/designates area

About the phrase "The term Connemara is the northern area…". English is not my language, therefore I will not risk myself at correcting the page. But obviously a term cannot be an area. A dog barks; the concept of a dog does not. A term is about a thing; a term resides in our thought, in our language, not in the outside world. Should we write "The term Connemara designates the northern area…"? --Dominique Meeùs (talk) 02:38, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

"The term Connemara is the northern area" and "The term Connemara designates the northern area" are exactly equivalent.

ICE77 (talk) 03:59, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

Comment and questions

1. The map, at a minimum, should show some important streets and towns in the Connemara area like N59 and Clifden/Letterfrack. 2. What is the difference between Catholic and civil parishes? 3. Is it really "O Malleys" or should it be "O'Malleys"? ICE77 (talk) 04:09, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

1:Why?

2:See Civil parishes in Ireland

3:I am not sure, but seeing the other names it looks that it should be "Ó Malley".

The Banner talk 09:22, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

My penny's worth on this:

1. This would require it to be much bigger and might increase controversy. What I would say is that the map shows only 2 of at least 3 valid positions. I actually agree myself with the pink extent (the red is valid but conservative), but I know some who'd see reason in an even more extensive area, which would extend in to Barna.

2. In a nutshell, civil parishes are old and now almost unused legal areas, and were connected to religious parishes long ago. They still relate to Anglican parishes, but Catholic parishes ended up much bigger, then split up, and so are no longer linked.

3. In English, it is O'Malley / O'Malleys (apostrophe required), and this is what you will find in most documents in Ireland. As Gaeilge (in Irish), it is Ó Máille (male) / Ní Mháille (female) - Irish language names do not have apostrophes, just the Ó or Ní, which means "descendent of" and a space before the lineal name.

194.154.66.41 (talk) 07:50, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

On the map and definition question

While I see the point above about the limitations of referencing on a question with no firm answer, I think it is useful to reference the extremes, at least here on the discussion page.

For example, a highly experienced mapping company goes with a conservative definition:

Harvey - Superwalker Map of Connemara

while a roadsign shows a broad area, pretty much all West Galway (even potentially including Joyce Country, which as stated, is definitely *not* in Connemara):

Photo of Connemara map on road in Connemara

while this "Connemara tour" map takes the Oughterard-Maam Cross-Gortmore-Clifden approach to the southern boundary (no one disputes that the area stretches to Killary Harbour), and omits Kinvara, Rosaveel and Lettermore, which many (like myself) would see as "inside":

Cycle tour map

while this one by a knowledgeable local tour company stresses a strict eastern boundary, short of Leenaun, down the Inagh Valley to Recess, then to the coast by way of Cashel and Roundstone:

Connemara Coastal Tours - map

All this stresses how hard this question is, which is I suppose tricky for an encyclopedia, but this is the real-life reality. 194.154.66.41 (talk) 07:50, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

I suspect that the Coastal Tour company map is just of the area included in their tours rather than purporting to be a definitive map of Connemara. --Red King (talk) 12:00, 29 October 2019 (UTC)

The map is original research, I have deleted it

Green indicates Joyce Country, with pale green showing it at its greatest defined extent; Red indicates Connemara, with pink showing it at its greatest defined extent

The map is not based on any reliable sources, is uncited since 2011, and is just someone's opinion. I have deleted it per WP:OR. --Red King (talk) 12:00, 29 October 2019 (UTC)