Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/School of Fashion and Design London

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Wifione ^Message 16:17, 24 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

School of Fashion and Design London

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No real indication of notability beyond its own website. One mention in the Guardian, cited in the article. 0 results in Google News, no relevant results on Google Books, no results on the website of the London College of Contemporary Arts, of which it supposedly a part.

Article created by a blocked sockpuppet whose speciality was "tag teaming and promotional editing behaviour at London School of Business and Finance", another affiliate of the LCCA. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 12:49, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

~~Delete~~ as per related investigations over on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Neri Karra. Didn't see any evidence of this institution's notability Mabalu (talk) 14:16, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

~~Selective merge to London College of Contemporary Arts~~ Changing vote as per PWilkinson below, and after some consideration. Definitely a merge. I am not sure it has sufficent notability to stand separately from the parent college. Mabalu (talk) 15:37, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note that it appears to have existed before becoming part of the London College of Contemporary Arts. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:48, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'd want to see some evidence of this - simply existing in itself without receiving sufficient attention doesn't sound terribly notable. Mabalu (talk) 15:58, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

DELETE. Now totally convinced my original reaction was correct. Mabalu (talk) 02:22, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:07, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fashion-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:07, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:07, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect or selective merge to London College of Contemporary Arts The nominator may have found no results on the website of the London College of Contemporary Arts, but I certainly found a page for the School there. However, I am seeing nothing that demonstrates independent notability - so a redirect as a search term and a mention there should probably suffice. PWilkinson (talk) 13:23, 28 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Degree-awarding institutions are generally held to be notable. Clearly has a separate existence from its "parent" college, which is merely an umbrella body. -- Necrothesp (talk) 09:46, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'm happy to defer to the opinion of others here. A couple of questions though, just to be clear on what we are talking about: do we not consider this page on the website of the agglomeration of schools of which this thing is a part to be "its own website"? And what is the evidence that it awards degrees? I see that it offers a course leading to an MSc Fashion, Design & Luxury Management; but that the degree is awarded by the Grenoble Graduate School of Business. I don't see any other evidence of degree-awarding on the site of the school. I tried this search in the hope of finding the list of degree-awarding institutions supposedly previously maintained by the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, but the National Archive seems to be the National Fail, and just yields an error message. Does anyone know if that list is still maintained, and if so, where? Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:26, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Replying to myself, I found this list. The School of Fashion and Design is not on it; nor, as far as I can see, is the London College of Contemporary Arts. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:31, 30 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment -- I am very suspicious as to both the subject of this discussion and LCCA. For the moment the best solution will be a selective merge to LCCA. I note that LCCA has an org.uk, not an ac.uk web address (which is unusual for a reputable institution). Before I could acknowledge notability, I would want to see that there are a significnat number of students studying fulltime. Are we sure that this is not one of the proliferation of so-called colleges that were purporting to offer courses, but were actually a front to get people around UK immigration control, enabling them to work here without studying? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Peterkingiron (talk • contribs)

Or indeed some other variety of diploma mill. At the risk of boring everyone, I reiterate that this article was created by blocked user:Chernenkaya, whose area of interest was the London School of Business and Finance, with which the LCCA is associated, and which is also notable for its apparent absence from the HEDD list I cited above. I'd be grateful for clarification, perhaps from Necrothesp or someone equally well-informed, on whether an institution needs to award its own degrees to be automatically notable by our standards. According to our articles here, neither the LSBF nor the LCCA does so. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 20:39, 4 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Mark Arsten (talk) 03:00, 5 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I am not satisfied that this exists as a separate institution and there is a lack of RS establishing either status or the claims made that it offers undergraduate and postgraduate study in the sense we would understand it. It may, of course, be properly associated with another accredited institution, but I am puzzled at the absence of any clear statement to that effect on the school's website. Unless I have missed something neither this nor the London College of Contemporary Arts is listed on the UK Border Agency list of approved sponsors nor are they listed as subscribing institutions of the Quality Assurance Agency for Higher Education. That need not be conclusive if a convincing alternative accreditation exists, but as pointed out it also fails the HEDD datacheck. Those are very clear official warnings to prospective students, and I suggest WP editors as well. --AJHingston (talk) 12:19, 10 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note. On the LCCA, I for one am fully convinced by the reasoning of AJHingston, following on the doubts expressed by Peterkingiron above. Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/London College of Contemporary Arts. I also remain convinced, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, that School of Fashion and Design London should be a delete in preference to a merge. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:56, 10 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Based on the discussuion above, a merge seems to be a reasonable way out of this dilemma. Bearian (talk) 21:00, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. This is an infomercial, not an encyclopedia Article. If the subject is notable, we can always write a new Article from scratch, after deleting the ad. The Mysterious El Willstro (talk) 03:36, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Relisting comment: I was about to close it as no consensus, but the last votes tend to delete, so let us discuss one more week.--Ymblanter (talk) 07:25, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ymblanter (talk) 07:25, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Where is the coverage in independent, reliable sources? One article in Guardian in which an employee speaks on a fashion, and is only one of several different interviewees, does not cut it. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 08:09, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, I'm not convinced that the sources exist which discuss this as an independent body. Given the somewhat questionable notability of the LCCA itself, an article on a single department or unit doesn't really cut the mustard I think. Lankiveil ^{(speak to me)} 12:36, 17 October 2013 (UTC).[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.