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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hela metal

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 20:10, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hela metal

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Hela metal (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)
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The subject does not seem to meet WP:N and WP:V. The sources in the article are unreliable and/or do not contain any significant coverage (and are used very dubiously as well, as if just thrown in there somewhere). Nothing on Google News and there are no reliable sources among the few Google hits either. This seems to be just another case where a (barely notable) band claims to have invented a new genre. Prolog (talk) 06:10, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep . Per comments on the talk page when it was PRODed, At least one of the links is to a Sri Lankan newspaper, and if you search the Sri Lankan edition of Google for "Hela Metal" (with quotes) you get around [2380 results], about 8 times the number of hits as you do in the US version, so I think great care needs to be taken in using search results as an indicator of notabillity. Clearly this subject is going to be more notable in its home country than elsewhere. It needs improvement, and I've already tried to move the article in the right direction to assist the original editor, but I think there is enough 'buzz' in the Sri Lankan results to suggest it is a genuine genre in Sri Lanka and should be given time for better editing and sourcing rather than just deleting outright. --ThePaintedOne (talk) 07:32, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • The comments on the talk page do not address the issues for which the article was prodded and nominated for deletion. If there is no coverage in reliable sources, Wikipedia's requirements for verifiability are not satisfied. And if there is no significant coverage, the requirements for notability are not satisfied. The newspaper article contains absolutely nothing about this "genre" and the metal webzine interviews are about the band speaking about themselves. Prolog (talk) 09:10, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • the PROD stated "No proof that this is a real genre. All sources are blogs. Google gives you 302 hits, the majority being just random words that happened to be in that order. ", so I addressed that the first ref is a newspaper and if you use the correct version of Google you get 8 times as many results, so yes the talk page post did address the concerns given in the PROD. The ref shows a local newspaper using "Hela Metal" to describe a band, so while it isn't much use as a cite for copy in the article, it does give evidence of the genre existing, as indeed do most of the other results coming back on google. The article definitely needs substantial improvement, but deletion is not cleanup.--ThePaintedOne (talk) 09:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • The article's bad state is not a valid reason for keeping it. The problem is the subject, of which an article that would meet Wikipedia's standards can apparently not be written. Instead of concentrating on the prod, you should be addressing the issues brought up in this discussion. The only way this article is going to be kept is if someone finds significant coverage in reliable sources. Terms used to describe a band do not classify as genres or as Wikipedia article subjects. Per WP:NEO, sources specifically about the term are needed, not just ones which mention it briefly or use it in passing. Prolog (talk) 12:07, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • There is no "correct" version of Google. Using a localized version will get you the same hits as the English version, only in a different order. Even with your link, it's less than 300 hits, with the majority still being random (Swedish) words that happened to be in that order. Go past page 4, and you will see. You might have clicked to see similar/several hits from one page, which will turn 9 hits into 600 hits. Erzsébet Báthory(talk|contr.) 12:09, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • When I click that link (in the UK) I get in excess of 2500 results, so clearly we are not going via the same routines. Not sure why that is, google is odd sometimes!--ThePaintedOne (talk) 12:15, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also, having gone to about page 10 on the results, only a handful (less than 10 total) have been random Swedish words. The overwhelming majority are discussing this topic. Mostly in unusable forums, blogs, etc, but there is quite a bit of it, which I why I said there is a buzz. Clearly there are a bunch of people in Sri Lanka who beleive this to be a genre.--ThePaintedOne (talk) 12:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
WP:MADEUP doesn't apply. It says "Wikipedia is not for things that you or your friends made up." But Hela Metal isn't a term just used by a bunch of kids in school, Sri Lankan journalists have used it. Google hits are totally irrelevant, you should realise that Sri Lankan sources are likely to be more poorly covered on the web, see WP:Systematic bias. By all means argue that there are insufficient reliable sources to show notability, but don't throw in invalid arguments. Fences&Windows 14:07, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comment If you really want further reasons for its deletion, try WP:NEO. There are no reliable sources that discuss this supposed genre in any depth whatsoever, and if Sri Lankan sources are more poorly covered then that's just back luck for the article. A genre consisting of one (very, very) borderline notable band is no genre at all; Raaksha may well also be referred to as hela metal, but are (thus far) not notable, and a genre of two would still fail a basic WP:N check. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 22:39, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. There is only one band that is talked about as being a "Hela metal" band. There is no proof about this being a popular phenomenon anywhere, aside from Funeral in Heaven. It is just like how Nile calls their music "Ithyphallic death metal", yet there is no wikipedia article of that "genre" and they are the only band that has been described as such on a non-rare basis. Also, the article does have repetition problems. BacktableSpeak to Meabout what I have done 00:13, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Now that's just not true. Raaksha are also called Hela Metal.[1] It's easy to make sweeping statements to back up arguments, but it doesn't make them correct. Fences&Windows 14:07, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
But is there significant coverage of the genre? Newspapers using an expression isn't enough to show notability. Fences&Windows 17:30, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. Guys, I looked through the Sri Lankan Google returns; the term is only found in association with the bands Raaksha and Funeral in Heaven, and only in blogs. 100% of the rest are random combinations of the words hela and metal in Scandinavian languages. I cannot see this as a sound basis for an article. Abductive (reasoning) 16:27, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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