Jeff the quiet

November 2010

Welcome!

Hello, Jeff the quiet, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

• The five pillars of Wikipedia
• Tutorial
• How to edit a page and How to develop articles
• How to create your first article (using the Article Wizard if you wish)
• Manual of Style

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{helpme}} before the question. Again, welcome! Royalbroil 13:11, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

WElcome also! I hope you will join us at WP-Wisconsin! Your photos are very nice. Many thanks=RFD (talk) 13:07, 14 August 2010 (UTC)

Royal or RFD(?), I think my article on Powers Bluff is finally ready for prime time. Do you have any suggestions, or should I just activate the categories at the bottom and move it out of my user subpage? Jeff the quiet (talk) 22:19, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

You can move it out now, and then nominate it for "DYK" (Did you know) before five days, so it can have a chance at appearing on Wikipedia's main page. /ƒETCHCOMMS/ 22:30, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Next time, please ask me on my talk page. It was ready, so I'm glad you moved it to articlespace. I think it would be a great article to nominate at DYK, just like Fetchcomms suggested.

I don't understand what Supertouch it doing below, nominating the redirect to be deleted. First, redirects are not eligible for speedy deletion for lack of content. Only if they direct to nothing. You redirected from a plausible name for the object. So I objected to the speedy. Royalbroil 04:46, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Hannibal, Wisconsin

Hi- One of the editors The Catalyst31 started articles about unincorporated communities that have Zipcodes/Post Offices. This included Hannibal, Wisconsin. The lead sentence was changed that there was no indication that Hannibal had a zipcode or is an unincorporated community. I change this back to the format used for unincorporated communities. I know The Catalyst31 have been starting articles involving unincorporated communities in the US that have POs/Zipcodes. I did leave the rest of your edits for they were good faith edits. It was the wording of the lead sentence that I was concerned about. Thanks-11:00, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

RFD, thanks for the explanation. I'll go ahead with redoing the edits outside the intro.

In the intro I removed the statement about the Hannibal post office because it's no longer there. It was closed a year or two ago by the USPS. The zip code is in the fact box, so restating it in the text seems redundant. Likewise "unincorporated community" and "United States" are in the fact box, so I removed them from the text, aiming for smoother reading. I can leave them as they were, if that seems best. Thoughts? Jeff the quiet (talk) 14:26, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

The USPS website still lists ZIP code 54439 as Hannibal, so it would appear that the post office is still open. If you have a source saying it closed, this can be changed. The ZIP code is usually in the text to go along with the post office, which I consider an important enough detail to put in the text. "Unincorporated community" is the type of settlement, and should definitely be in the text; it's like having "city" or "village" in the text. "United States" is in the text mostly for the benefit of non-US readers; while it's not essential, I usually leave it in. TheCatalyst31 ^{Reaction•Creation} 18:39, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Well, my parents live six miles from Hannibal, and my brother tells me that one of the locals bought the old post office building, sawed it into three pieces, and dragged it to the riverbank, where it waits reassembly. But that's probably not the kind of source you were thinking of.  :) I can't find a statement of its closure online, but if you use [1] to search for post offices near 54439, you'll find none in Hannibal itself. Jeff the quiet (talk) 05:14, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

I'm guessing what happened is they closed the post office but kept the ZIP code in service based on that. This is an unusual case, but in the interest of keeping the page accurate, the sentence about the post office should probably just be removed until some sources turn up. TheCatalyst31 ^{Reaction•Creation} 10:28, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Done. I moved the reference to the zip code in the fact box. Thanks. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:14, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi-I left a message for Catalyst31 to look at the article since that editor has worked on articles involving unincorporated communities that have POs/zipcodes. Except for the lead sentence your edits in most of the article were excellent. The edits to the lead sentence were unclear and would be classified as peacock words. The lead sentence of any article would be important because it identifies what the article is about-Thanks-RFD (talk) 14:44, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Peacock words!? Why, if I knew what those are I might be offended. ;) If your concern was the lead sentence, I can leave it as is. Are you content with appending my summary of Hannibal's history to the intro: "Today Hannibal is quiet, but once it was a bustling little economic hub at the junction of two logging railroads." ? Jeff the quiet (talk) 05:14, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

My apologies for any problems this may had caused. I had some concerns about the wording of the lead sentence of the article. The rest of the article I had no problems. I brought up peacock words for I think one of the editors would had done so. I have no problems with the last sentence of the article. Again my apologies. Thank you-RFD (talk) 13:49, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

RFD, no apology is necessary. I realize now that some recurring terms like "unincorporated community" have probably been wrangled over, and it's best to let sleeping dogs lie. After initial puzzlement, I've smiled through this. Thanks for your guidance and please continue to advise. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:14, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

1850 Survey Notes

Hey, Royal and/or RFD!

I was surprised and delighted last week to find that images of the notebooks from the massive 1830-1860 survey of Wisconsin are online! The Board of Commissioners of Public Lands and the UW-Madison Libraries have scanned them and put them online here. After spending an evening in this time machine, getting glimpses from 1850 of my old haunts, I realized that the general descriptions from the survey notes might fit into Wikipedia's articles on Wisconsin towns - the six by six kind.

I've transcribed a few of them, starting history sections in three articles:

• McKinley, Taylor County, Wisconsin (links to the original notes are references 3, 4 & 5 at the bottom)
• Jump River (town), Wisconsin
• Arpin (town), Wisconsin

To me, these are interesting. It's generally hard to find content for the town articles, and it should draw people into local history. Has someone already considered adding these to Wikipedia and run into problems? Legal?

Also, I added the PLSS township codes in the fact boxes. This seems to work fine, but I don't know much about fact boxes. Is the way I did it OK, or will it cause problems for something else?

For both of these changes, I'd like feedback before I sink much time into doing other towns. Thanks. Jeff the quiet (talk) 13:05, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm not aware of this being discussed before. It definitely belongs on the articles! I suggest starting a thread at WikiProject Wisconsin (where you should start all threads like this) to advertise this excellent resource. I think there's a resources page found at Wikipedia:WikiProject Wisconsin/Library. It's reliable. They're definitely legal and since published prior to 1923 in the U.S. legally in the public domain. The strictest public domain in the world that I know about is 100 years after death of the author which even that should be no problem. Don't get me wrong, a source doesn't need to be public domain to be used. Royalbroil 00:24, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Great! The site that holds the survey notes asks for notification if one links to their site, so I've e-mailed the Board of Commissioners of Public Lands. Once they bless this, I'll start a thread on WikiProject Wisconsin. Thanks! Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:17, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

You don't need their permission. Wikipedia is definitely educational and non-commercial. I think you're reading it wrong, they're offering to provide links out from their website. Royalbroil 01:44, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Happily, a lady from the Board replied in two days, confirming that it's OK to use the material in Wikipedia, and suggesting a simplification to the references. (How's that for a responsive, cooperative government?) I've restarted this thread on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Wisconsin/History. Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:30, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Sorry about the delayed response. I went to Door County for the weekend. It was both enjoyable and productive. I photographed 17 sites on the National Register! I got all of the ones north of Sturgeon Bay but I wasn't able to photograph any shipwrecks or islands. Anyhow, I don't understand why you made a subpage under WikiProject Wisconsin. No one can see that page except if they read this discussion. I was anticipating that you'd just start at regular thread at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Wisconsin and I don't see any reason to do otherwise. I can delete the page that you created if you request it from me, or I suppose you could continue the thread if you link to it (but I would expect most people to check it out at most one time). Royalbroil 02:40, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Hi, Royal. Your weekend sounds nice. I enjoy those NRHP lists, too. I didn't create the History subpage - it was there already. History seemed appropriate for this topic, but if you think it better to move the topic out to the main thread than to try to get people to look into the history subthread, I can do that. Let me know. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:02, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Yea, no one will find it. You should move it. I don't know why Baronlarf created it but I don't think it's useful. Royalbroil 00:48, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

License tagging for File:Mr Knox and Oxen.jpg

Thanks for uploading File:Mr Knox and Oxen.jpg. You don't seem to have indicated the license status of the image. Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate this information; to add a tag to the image, select the appropriate tag from this list, click on this link, then click "Edit this page" and add the tag to the image's description. If there doesn't seem to be a suitable tag, the image is probably not appropriate for use on Wikipedia.

For help in choosing the correct tag, or for any other questions, leave a message on Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. Thank you for your cooperation. --ImageTaggingBot (talk) 04:05, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Website for the town of Grover, Taylor County, Wisconsin

I found the Town of Grover website in Taylor County. [2] You might find it intersting. I added it to the article infobox-Thanks-RFD (talk) 13:32, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

• RFD, thanks. I wasn't aware of Grover's website. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:39, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

Issues with NRHP listings

You are doing such a great job of photographing listings on the National Register of Historic Places in your side of the state! Thank you so much! I know I ran into issues like empty properties, wrong address, etc. When that happens, there is a place to list them at Wikipedia:WikiProject National Register of Historic Places/NRIS information issues. That location is monitored by the National Register so they can deal with it. Unfortunately it's not for properties that are getting dilapidated. I've run into boarded up windows and almost non-existent paint. Royalbroil 12:16, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

• Thanks, Royal. I'm really enjoying taking photos and learning more about my back yard. I'll probably add one issue to the "information issues" page. The name in NRIS of one of my favorite places is confusing and could easily be disambiguated. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:58, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Thanks for submitting the Big Indian Farms submission at Articles for creation; the article has been published in Wikipedia's main mainspace. Also, thanks for improving Wikipedia's coverage of historic geographic topics. Northamerica1000(talk) 00:55, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, North. Jeff the quiet (talk) 05:49, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

List of National Natural Landmarks in Wisconsin

Are you aware of this list? There isn't much in east central Wisconsin for me to photograph. I thought that you might be interested with the great job that you've done with the National Register of Historic Places! Royalbroil 05:07, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, Royal. Those places sound interesting. I'll keep them in mind for next summer. Jeff the quiet (talk) 05:49, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

NRHP images

Good job you've been doing with NRHP photographs. I was curious if you would be able to get photos for the last two unillustrated sites in Clark County. I have no idea how close you live, but one of the two sites is in Neillsville, not far from the Charles and Katharyn Sniteman House (File:Charles and Katharyn Sniteman House.jpg) which you photographed in May. The main motivation is selfish; I wrote the Omaha Hotel article, and would like to see a photo in the article. Anyway, keep on photographing, hopefully every NRHP will one day be illustrated. Chris857 (talk) 01:17, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Chris. We get to Neillsville every month or two, and I'll get a photo some time, but it may take a while to catch the hotel in a good light. I ran across your article the other night and enjoyed it. Thanks. Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:45, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

WLM photo contest and addon by NRHP

I want you to be aware of Wikipedia:WikiProject National Register of Historic Places/NRHP Fall 2013 Photo Contest in case you want to add any challenges or participate. I hope you have some nominees for the main contest. I hope that you can give me a run for the money in Wisconsin! I was fortunate enough to have the Ashland County Courthouse as a nominee in front of the final jury last year.

You take great photographs and have MUCH better photo editing skills than I do! Do you know of any resources for me to take a class (especially audit) to learn how to improve my photo editing skills? I need to learn how to check for artefacts, how far to go with brightness / saturation, how to correct for lens curvature on buildings, etc. Royalbroil 12:37, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Royal. Thanks for letting me know about the contest. I'll upload a couple photos soon, but the pickings are getting slim around here, so I won't have any large numbers.

I'm glad you like my photos, but I don't do much editing. My main technique is to photograph in the early morning or evening, when the filtered sunlight brings out colors. Lately I've been using a polarized lens filter some to blunt the bright light at other times of day, with some success. I tend to take a half dozen shots of the object, with slightly different framing and exposures, and later pick one that appeals to me. Sometimes I crop them with GIMP. That's about all I can tell you.

Though I won't be a contender in the photo contest, it's a good idea. It should energize some who have taken photos for Wikipedia before. Well-conceived. Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:14, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

A Dobos torte for you!

7&6=thirteen (☎) has given you a Dobos Torte to enjoy! Seven layers of fun because you deserve it. To give a Dobos Torte and spread the WikiLove, just place {{subst:Dobos Torte}} on someone else's talkpage, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend.

7&6=thirteen (☎) 12:53, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Sanborn fire insurance map links

Hi Jeff, I know you went to a lot of work a while back to add all the links to Sanborn fire insurance maps to Wisconsin locality articles. I thought I'd let you know that someone has started removing them: [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], [8], [9], [10], [11], [12], [13], [14], [15], [16], [17], [18], [19], [20], [21], [22], [23], [24], [25], [26], [27], [28], [29], [30], [31], [32], [33], [34], [35]. I tried reverting this vandalism, but the editor is in an edit warring frame of mind. 32.218.37.86 (talk) 00:06, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. I added my two cents at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#32.218.37.86_disruptive_editing. Jeff the quiet (talk) 01:30, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	Recently came across your work expanding (and creating) articles about sites on the National Register of Historic Places in Wisconsin. Just wanted to say good job and that your quality work is extremely appreciated. Keep it up! Dudemanfellabra (talk) 07:55, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

File:Mr Knox and Oxen.jpg

When you contacted Friends of Fred Smith, Inc. regarding the copyright on this sculpture, did they say anything more broad about the sculptures in the Wisconsin Concrete Park in general? I was there last weekend and would like to add some of my pictures to the article, but I want to make sure I have the copyright status on the sculptures sorted out before I upload anything. TheCatalyst31 ^{Reaction•Creation} 03:09, 3 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Catalyst. Here's how the OK from Friends of Fred Smith began:

I hereby assert that Friends of Fred Smith, Inc. is sole owner of the exclusive copyright to Fred Smith’s work at the Wisconsin Concrete Park in Phillips, WI. And therefore can grant permission for the attached photograph of “Mr. Knox and Oxen” of Aug 29, 2010 to be published electronically on Wikipedia. Friends of Fred Smith, Inc. (FoFS) agrees to publish...

So taken literally, I think it's constrained to my one photo. Lisa from FoFS was very pleasant though, so you could try asking for additional permissions. Jeff the quiet (talk) 00:46, 4 August 2016 (UTC)

O'Brien-Peuschel Farmstead, and other Wisconsin NRHPs

Thank you for expanding the O'Brien-Peuschel Farmstead article and bringing it out of "NRIS-only" status. I happened to notice it in this big diff of recent changes to a list of NRIS-only and other short articles. I too am working to remove articles from that list.

In this edit following yours, i added the available link to accompanying photos. Perhaps you are not aware you can get those? In case it helps, my NRHP draft reference is:

<ref name=nrhpdoc>{{cite web|url={{NRHP url|id=}}|title=National Register of Historic Places Inventory/Nomination: or Registration: |publisher=[[National Park Service]]|author= |date= |accessdate= }} with {{NRHP url|id=|photos=y|title=photos}}</ref>

I copy-paste that into articles and revise it. Use or adapt if you like! Thanks and keep up the good work. --doncram 03:33, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Hey, this is a further offer. If you're interested in addressing all the remaining Wisconsin "NRIS-only" articles in a joint effort, I'd be willing/happy to shift my efforts to this, instead of doing other stuff for a while. It seems there are 125 such articles now, which I just ran a report about and listed them at User:Doncram/Batch-ID-KY-ND-WI#WI NRIS-only. I could use AutoWikiBrowser to put the NRHP reference into each of the 125 articles, along with an "Under Construction" type tag and category, customized slightly for each article, in one editing session. That would be pretty efficient to start on them all. Then it would require followup development at each article, in expanding out the NRHP reference and in developing the article a bit using the information. That would work on all the articles for which NRHP documents are available, hopefully most of these Wisconsin topics. I would be happy to do some, maybe half of that followup editing, if you would too. Let me know if you'd like to do that together. Or I'd be happy to cooperate in some different way if you have an idea. Cheers, --doncram 19:20, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi, Don. That sounds good. I'm willing to help. Jeff the quiet (talk) 02:20, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Great! I went ahead and used AWB on a first set of 12 articles, at User:Doncram/Batch-ID-KY-ND-WI#first batch of 12. And I followed up on one, developing its article somewhat, and then striking it from that list. It happened to be a complicated one, where the expected URL for NRHP photos worked but the URL for NRHP text did not, and the relevant NRHP text information was located instead in a wp:MPS document. Hopefully most of the rest will have straightforward sourcing. I'd be very happy if you would proceed to develop some of the others and strike them off, and I will too. I will comment further at User:Doncram/Batch-ID-KY-ND-WI#WI NRIS-only, where maybe any further discussion can continue. --doncram 16:19, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi, I think our little campaign is going great, don't you? I have been happy to see you plugging along and have been encouraged to plug along, myself. I guess I can go ahead and use AWB again to lay the draft NRHP nomination reference into the remaining articles, assuming you agree that it helps a little bit, though we both are perfectly capable of creating the reference as needed anyhow. Also, if you don't mind, I'd like to move the project tracking over to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Wisconsin... i would move over the entire worklist of 125 items and our comments so far, from User:Doncram/Batch-ID-KY-ND-WI#WI NRIS-only. That way a few other Wisconsin-interested editors might see the activity going on. Whether or not others get directly involved, they could comment and it would be not a bad thing for them to see other stuff going on. I am trying to remember now about exactly where, but I did chat sometime recently with another Wisconsin editor, perhaps about an article or two they were editing which I happened to notice....i would invite them if i can find them. Right now I am thinking I would just move the worklist right into the Talk page and keep discussing it there. If you or anyone else objects that it is overwhelming the conversation there, it could get moved to a subpage. But the problem is lack of activity, IMHO, about almost all of the state-specific Wikiprojects. (Hmm, there is also the Wikipedia:The 50,000 Challenge going on, slowly, and with certain problems...maybe we could help that project out too, i would be happy to discuss with any Wisconsin others, though I don't want to put in effort that is wasted.) Let me know what you think. cheers, --doncram 20:26, 21 April 2017 (UTC)

I agree with all you said. I've enjoyed pecking away at your list, and it is refreshing to work alongside others. Offering your list to other Wisconsin editors may inspire some, and certainly won't hurt anything. I didn't pay much attention to the 50,000 Challenge, but if we're doing the work anyway, we might as well help its numbers. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:38, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

Thinking a little further, your lists of NRHP sites are a good resource for the 50,000 Challenge. Finding enough information in quality references has to be an obstacle for many would-be contributors, but your links to the nomination papers remove that obstacle. The NRHP stubs also seem like a gentle place for new editors to cut their teeth, since the history of old buildings is about as non-controversial as it gets. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:14, 23 April 2017 (UTC)

Let's switch over for the last 27 out of 125, to track at wt:Wisconsin#NRHP articles especially needing help. --Doncram (talk) 01:58, 10 March 2018 (UTC)

I see that I missed this thread until now. I noticed this thread before the comments at WP:WISCONSIN. I'll look over the list to see which ones I photographed but a quick scan shows few. I suppose that I often will develop that article when adding photographs. Having visited the place is very helpful for expansion. I don't have much discretionary time so no promises. Thanks to both of you for your efforts! Royalbroil 13:20, 10 March 2018 (UTC)

Good work!

I've seen your work on the Milwaukee and Ozaukee NRHP pages. Thanks!

Also, I wanted to ask your opinion. Milwaukee River Parkway is both in the city of Milwaukee, and outside of it. Do you think it should go on both city and county pages, or only the city page? -Freekee (talk) 18:01, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Hi, Freekee. I don't know the Parkway, but from this map it certainly appears to have parts in both the city and county of Milwaukee. If so, listing it on both pages seems very much like listing the Merrimac Ferry in both National Register of Historic Places listings in Sauk County, Wisconsin and National Register of Historic Places listings in Columbia County, Wisconsin. But I didn't set those up, and don't know the pros and cons. Maybe ask Magicpiano, since he seems to add most of the new entries now, and he has probably faced the question before? Jeff the quiet (talk) 03:44, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Cool. Thanks! -Freekee (talk) 04:45, 20 April 2017 (UTC)

Wisconsin NRHPs going forward

Hey, I wonder if we could chat a little about development of Wisconsin NRHPs going forward. User:Royalbroil too. --Doncram (talk) 23:00, 3 April 2018 (UTC) It is very unusual what Jeff the quiet has done, and certainly quite fine, in developing descriptions sourced to NRHP nomination documents and sources for many/most Wisconsin NRHP topics, within the county list-articles, without starting stub articles. In all other states, editors including myself have plunged ahead creating stub articles, sometimes with good sources and sometimes not (and all are tracked in wp:NRHPPROGRESS which understates the degree of good coverage in Wisconsin).

Jeff the quiet, how do you see progress going forward? Shall I and others collaborate in creating all the missing articles, presumably including more information than is included in the brief descriptions? And, FYI it is not surprising to see an editor or two arriving or returning and creating a bunch of stub articles, without the NRHP document sources. Please see "User talk:Packerfansam#Wisconsin NRHP articles". The editor has just created several articles out of National Register of Historic Places listings in Brown County, Wisconsin. I may have come across too negative already with them; they are a longterm constructive Wikipedia editor, seemingly returning to topic of WI NRHPs after a long break. I would like to be encouraging and collaborate with that editor. Actually it could be fine if they wish to proceed any way they want, creating stubs without the NRHP document sources, even though the NRHP document sources are already cited in well-formed citations from the corresponding list-articles. I could go along with cooperating and following along improving those articles. In the past I have been criticized for creating many very short stub articles (where NRHP documents were not then available), where the topics were clearly valid, and actually I would like to support this editor. Could we do a cooperative editing campaign with them, perhaps with a central worklist of articles being developed. Probably the pace would not be too fast to keep up with. I would prefer to be part of something positive than anything smacking of negative shit in the past (which you may not know about at all, but was pretty horrible). --Doncram (talk) 22:57, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

I have found @Packerfansam: to be a very competent, long term Wikipedian who is pretty easy to work with. -- Dolotta (talk) 00:08, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

An alternative would be to fast-track development of WI NRHP topics, i.e. creating new articles using the current descriptions and their sources. In many cases, that can include adding the photos submitted as part of NRHP nominations, which often are omitted from the sources in the NRHP county list-articles. And presumably choosing to use more from the NRHP nom docs. --Doncram (talk) 00:39, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

I'd like to focus on filling in the summaries on the county lists, adding links to the NRHP nominations and WHS docs so readers can find that info. That seems the biggest payoff for my efforts. There are still huge lists around Madison and Milwaukee that I've hardly touched - years of work still to be done.

I'm willing to help flesh out some stub articles, especially interesting ones, but right now I'm a little burnt out on them. They're not as rewarding to me as seeing a county list grow. If others create missing/stub articles, that's fine. Each is a step in the right direction. I saw some of your talk with Sam and it seemed helpful. The NRHP nomination papers probably weren't available for Wisconsin when he/she last worked on this stuff, so it's good that you pointed him/her toward better sources. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:15, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

It looks like it will be messy going forward, in terms of articles not exactly matching summaries and vice versa. Neenah United States Post Office is an example, where new article created with apparent awareness but not copy-pasting of the already-existing summary with its NRHP doc reference. And complicating matters perhaps, there's now a new version of NRHP doc reference that is readily available now within Elkman's NRHP infobox generator as of yesterday maybe (see note at wt:WI), which in this example was deleted/not included in the new article. I wonder, are there many NRHPs remaining anywhere in Wisconsin where there are not yet summaries? Maybe the other editor could be encouraged to create articles there, and then your creation of summaries can follow perfectly efficiently? --Doncram (talk) 22:02, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

Hi again. George W. and Sarah Trogner House new article includes the NRHP reference at the corresponding county list-article, which I presume was created by you. Both copies of the reference could be improved by including links to the accompany photos, which would be included if one were adopting a reference suggested by the Elkman NHRP infobox generator. I am wondering about embarking upon a campaign to improve the NRHP document references (to add the photos links) in the Wisconsin NRHP list-articles. --Doncram (talk) 23:39, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

Hi, Don. That start of George W. and Sarah Trogner House looks good, with sufficient good references that it won't get the nris-only template. His new articles that I've seen lately have all met that standard, and I think that's thanks to your nudges.

Regarding adding links to the NRHP docs and photos to the list-articles. I'm working on that for National Register of Historic Places listings in Walworth County, Wisconsin, and will continue on those southeastern counties. I wouldn't mind going back and doing the same for some of the counties where I wrote summaries before the NRHP docs were available for Wisconsin, like National Register of Historic Places listings in Barron County, Wisconsin. It makes a lot more information available without a lot of labor. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:01, 15 April 2018 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The WikiProject Wisconsin Barnstar
		I think it is about time you have received the WI barnstar with all your work on NRHP articles. -- Dolotta (talk) 18:44, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 04:38, 4 May 2018 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Photographer's Barnstar
		For getting two of your pictures published! Dolotta (talk) 18:34, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

Thanks, @Dolotta: Umm... which two pictures are you talking about? -Jeff the quiet (talk) 01:47, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

• I created a user page listing all of the WP pictures listed in the book here -- Dolotta (talk) 01:50, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

about 4 WI hotels

Hi! i see you've been busy, including developing National Register of Historic Places listings in Milwaukee. Hey i've been working on a list of hotels, and at National Registry of the Historic Hotels of America#Wisconsin there are 4 WI hotels, about which i can figure out 2 are NRHP-listed, now reflected in their articles. Can you tell if either of the other two are? AFAICT, the Hilton Milwaukee City Center is not included in the West Side Commercial Historic District in Milwaukee; The Edgewater in Madison also is not NRHP-listed? cheers, --Doncram (talk) 08:20, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Hi, Don. I don't think either is listed on the NRHP. Neither is in our NRHP lists for their respective cities, or in the Wisconsin Historical Society's website. From the Hilton's own website, it certainly looks like an NRHP candidate, with its nice Art Deco styling. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 05:18, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for checking! About Art Deco for the Hilton, hmm, the current Hilton Milwaukee City Center article just says "neo-classical style" and doesn't link to any official hotel webpage. Its HHA page does say Art Deco. Do you mean the pic in this Hilton.com page for it (maybe that is its official page?)? I dunno. That page does call it an "Art Deco landmark". But it is nothing like Niagara Mohawk Building near where i have lived some (hmm, its article needs more pics) which is really over the top / spectacular in being the implementation of Art Deco styling, I think originally a matter for 2-dimensional graphics/illustration, into 3-D architecture. Thanks again, cheers, --Doncram (talk) 06:07, 10 April 2020 (UTC) P.S. do feel free to change what i left in table row for West Side Commercial! Or better, start its article! --Doncram (talk) 06:07, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Yes: that Hilton.com page is where I got the Art Deco classification from. (I would have probably guessed Beaux Arts, if on my own.) You're right: the Hilton doesn't look much like your Niagara Mohawk building, but the 2-D decorative panels on the bottom section resemble those on the Hotel du Collectionneur image on our Art Deco page. The Hilton design could well incorporate elements from both Art Deco and Neoclassical styles. E.g. in that Hilton photo, the grooved frames on those tall windows suggest a weird inverted pilaster with a column base at the bottom.

Isn't it fun to analyze, rather than just summarize? -Jeff the quiet (talk) 14:10, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Hilton Milwaukeee City Center upper detail

Hmm, yes, possibly though I can't see the panels very well there. There are panels towards the top which do look Art Deco yes, in "detail" pic to right here. Need more pics! And more sourcing about this hotel's architecture!--Doncram (talk) 17:52, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Take a look at this article, if you haven't seen it. It tells the original architects and relates the hotel to some other buildings. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 22:03, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Graphs

Thank you for all the work you've been doing on the graphs. I feel gratitude for all your number crunching. Looking at the viewership this is one of those things where you get to decide whether it is worth your effort to keep the data up-to-date. If it is not worth your effort I think it is time to delete the page and replace the "See also" sections with "External links" to another graph website.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 02:54, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, Epi. I too have been watching the page-views decline. Given that, and that DHS now provides similar graphs of county trends, I've been wondering when to pull the plug on this page. But the numbers aren't much work. (Each day I just download the new spreadsheet, run a program, paste the result into the Wiki page, and look at the counties I'm particularly interested in.) And my format is more convenient (at least for me) than the DHS's charts. So I'll probably keep updating them for a while anyway. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 00:39, 27 August 2020 (UTC)

It has been more convenient for me, too.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 03:10, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

October 2020

Welcome to Wikipedia. We appreciate your contributions, but in one of your recent edits to Evansville Standpipe, it appears that you have added original research, which is against Wikipedia's policies. Original research refers to material—such as facts, allegations, ideas, and personal experiences—for which no reliable, published sources exist; it also encompasses combining published sources in a way to imply something that none of them explicitly say. Please be prepared to cite a reliable source for all of your contributions. You can have a look at the tutorial on citing sources. You added a photo from a completely different article, and compared it to the photo in the article you were editing, adding what appeared to be a personal commentary. Magnolia677 (talk) 21:10, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

Hi, @Magnolia677: Tim Heggland's nomination, which I cited in the caption, states: "A similar 175-foot-tall stone-clad Gothic Revival style example is the North Point Water Tower in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, which was built in 1874 to a design by Charles A. Gombert. This tower houses a four-foot-diameter metal standpipe that is encircled by a spiral staircase that leads up to a small room at the top of the tower." Is the first sentence of my caption not drawn from that?

Yes, North Point is from a different article, but it's helpful context, showing that not all "standpipes" look like a plain pipe. My second sentence "Tiny Evansville couldn't afford such vanity." is somewhat an inference from Heggland's account of the wrangling over building the waterworks. I can remove that if you want. -Jeff the quiet (talk) 00:11, 12 October 2020 (UTC)

Statistical graphs

Are you ready to throw in the towel on the graphs?--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 20:14, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Hi, @Epiphyllumlover: Yes, I haven't updated Statistics of the COVID-19 pandemic in Wisconsin for a couple months. The DHS changed the format of their spreadsheet again and I haven't had time or motivation to figure out how to adapt my program to the new version. So I just proposed that page for deletion. You can adjust your link to it from the Door County page however you think best.

I'd rather think of this as the end of a good chapter than throwing in the towel.  ;) -Jeff the quiet (talk) 01:09, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Instead of proposing it for deletion, you could just redirect it to COVID-19 pandemic in Wisconsin. That way the edit history is saved for going back and re-using bits and pieces on individual county articles.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 01:15, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Good idea. I tried it and it seems to work. (My first redirect!) -Jeff the quiet (talk) 01:27, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

And someday maybe a decade from now someone who wants a graph to illustrate their county's history section could benefit from your work. Thank you for working on it for as long as you did. Even if you had wanted to keep it going now, it would have been complicated to do so because some county health departments are only putting out weekly statistics now.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 18:00, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Jefferson High School

Hi Jeff the quiet, I'm having some difficulty developing Draft:Jefferson_High_School_(Jefferson,_Wisconsin), wonder if you could help? I am not sure how many Jefferson High Schools there might be in Wisconsin, and/or how many buildings the one in Jefferson, Wisconsin has had. I arrived from Draft:Lawrence Monberg; Monberg designed a Jefferson High School, maybe the current building. But National Register of Historic Places listings in Jefferson County, Wisconsin indicates that the building or former building was designed by someone else. Note some info/references in the draft are still from a different high school from which I borrowed text/infobox and have not fully purged the other school's info. --Doncram (talk) 00:48, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, @Doncram:. I'm pretty far from Jefferson, but I did find [36], which establishes that Monberg worked on a Jefferson High School in the city of Jefferson, and that it has been demolished. You probably saw [37] from Google search. [38] also associates Monberg with Jefferson High School.

If you're looking for other Monberg designs in Wisconsin, look through [39]. --Jeff the quiet (talk) 01:49, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks so much, those help a lot! I see one gives 1963 for construction of his Jefferson High School, and they all help. I had found the essay one but not the others. I guess the Jefferson High School went thru a number of iterations, and the article is coming along now. --Doncram (talk) 02:23, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

User:Jeff the quiet and User:Royalbroil, FYI, i just commented at Talk:Chicago, St. Paul, Minneapolis and Omaha Railroad Car Shop Historic District about a brand new article about an NRHP-isted place in Wisconsin, by maybe a new editor in this area. It reads as if the editor is informed, but does not cite an NRHP document or any other text source at all. Perhaps you'd like to comment/guide/contribute? cheers, --Doncram (talk,contribs) 02:27, 15 November 2022 (UTC)

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File:David Drummond House.jpg

Is this the Rogers-Drummond House? If yes, I would like to add your contribution to this page here, for clarification. 多多123 (✉ • ✎) 12:51, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

I searched online, I may be confused with a different location. 12:55, 26 March 2023 (UTC) 多多123 (✉ • ✎) 12:55, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

Hi. The David Drummond house in Wisconsin is pretty clearly not this house, if this is Rogers-Drummond. The NRHP nomination tells about Drummond the man. It doesn't mention him ever going to Texas, so I'd guess it's a different Drummond. --Jeff the quiet (talk) 17:41, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I only thought it may have been until I searched for it at 12:55, thanks, Jeff. 多多123 (✉ • ✎) 18:02, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

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