Talk:Withering to Death

Translation of track listing

Can someone please provide a Wikipedia guideline article on article translation, regarding track listings containing tracks with non-English titles? Most importantly, are they even supposed to be translated? After all, it seems to me that translation of track titles is potentially fraught (though on a much smaller scale) with the same caveats regarding translation of complete literary works. That translation of titles is a non-trivial matter can be seen by browsing through movie titles in imdb and see how in some cases, completely different titles are used in a movie and its translation to another language. Unless there is a widely used translation which can be found in multiple, citeable sources, I'm personally somewhat wary of adding one's own take on the translation of the titles. - February 8, 2006 by 67.160.10.87

Unless the band gives a translation, or it's something simple, like one or two words, I would just leave them in their language. SuperDT 14:01, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

I'd strongly oppose this. There is so little properly referenced information about this band, its history and discography as it is, paired with certain ... let's say "reckless" fans, eager to fill the gaps with hearsay and and their own opinion. Encouraging unofficial translations of song titles would literally open the floodgates. - Cyrus XIII 14:35, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

No translations please. It didn't happen in the US album release, why should it happen here?

Merge with CLEVER SLEAZOID article?

"It has been suggested that CLEVER SLEAZOID be merged into this article or section."

• Being entirely seperate releases, there is no need for this to happen. Despite the similiar content, the two releases have a differing focus and previous similiarities in releases by the same artist do not face this situation either. - February 15, 2006 by 202.156.6.54

• Since this single isn't even in the album, why is this being even considered? - February 28, 2006 by 70.133.98.185

• The single was released after the album. Why would the single be considered merged with Withering to death? - April 22, 2006 by 71.144.11.114

• In case this issue still needs a comment (half a year later): Oppose, due to common sense. - Cyrus XIII 14:35, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

Name change

Was it really...necessary? Considering the fact that the title is spelled with a lowercase 'd' in death...why isn't this reflected in the article's title? Ric | opiaterein 20:52, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Because Wikipedia has a policy regarding names of albums, singles, songs or for that matter all kinds of copyrighted/trademarked material, that favors the use of proper English (and in this context title case) over capitalization-related eccentricies. This has been recently applied to all Dir en grey-related articles, resulting in far more readable text bodies and track lists. Given the massive amount of data accumulating in this encyclopedia, taking this coherent approach makes perfectly sense. See also: WP:MOSCL, WP:MOSTM and WP:ALBUMS. - Cyrus XIII 22:36, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

I think that names should be written the way they are on the official Dir en grey homepage. It's misleading to have it written any other way than it should officially be. Even the band's name, Dir en grey, is written with a lowercase, should the grey begin with an uppercase g? - Kirimoto 17:32, 25 November 2006

That's a little different. Neither is the band's name comprised of words from a single language, nor does it have a clearly identifiable meaning (which would still be the case in most occurrences of Engrish). Unique names/phrases can retain their inherent capitalization. See WP:NC#Album titles and band names. That bit about "stylized typography" might still call for this article to be moved to "Withering to Death" (without the period). - Cyrus XIII 00:24, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Cyrus, the reverted edit on your part was a mistake. I am a representative for Free-Will-America, and the DVD was the same for each region. Please check your facts before spreading "fact" that isn't true. Steven 20:48, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

And you actually believe, that this kind of assertion has got any pull on Wikipedia or for that matter the internet? Now that would be great, I could claim that my mother's uncle was a distant cousin of Ringo Starr and then unearth new evidence regarding the Paul is dead mystery without having to provide any source whatsoever. You get the idea? Come up with a citation to back up your claims and everything will be fine. But please try to implement your changes without broken links, it is really not that hard. - Cyrus XIII 21:19, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Okay, here you go. [1] is your proof. I'm not going to edit again, as I've already done so once and you decided to change it back.

If you look at the bonus DVD, you will see exactly what I had edited in the other day. On a completely different note -- why was the untrue "fact" okay, without any source whatsoever? Steven 23:05, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Well, the link you provided seems to support your claim (albeit only for the North American release). To answer your question: It wasn't. Had you removed this "untrue fact" or replaced it with your version (along with a proper source), there would have been no objections. But your edit not only lacked a source, it was also a mess in terms of execution. You cannot expect fellow Wikipedians to bother with this sort of contribution, apart from reverting it, especially if various of your prior edits proved to be problematic as well. - Cyrus XIII 23:40, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Genre

I am very against tagging this album, as well like "Vulgar" as extreme and progressive metal. Why do You do so? I think because of simple fact it's encyclopedia such thing may make people wrong of exact contents of these recordings. Dir en grey "harder" period started from "The Marrow of a Bone" and claiming that previous albums are also "extreme metal" is big misrepresentation of truth. It may be tagged as "hard rock", as "industrial rock", as "nu metal", "alternative rock", or "experimental", but where someone can hear extremeness, or progressiveness? In such 3-minutes' melodious potential-radio hits? ... That's why I appeal for common sense! I may repeat: "Withering..." is not "extreme/progressive metal album"! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.219.186.93 (talk) 10:31, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

Requested move 3 July 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa (talk) 02:00, 11 July 2017 (UTC)

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Withering to Death. → Withering to Death – To remove the decorative terminating full stop, which is sometimes used in Japanese pop culture, but is confusing and contrary to Wikipedia article title conventions. Decorative full stops, and especially terminating full stops, are frowned upon in Wikipedia article titles, as in the "skate." example of MOS:TM and the prior RM discussions for Anderson Paak, Bakuman, Damn (Kendrick Lamar album), Fun (band), Gangsta (manga), India Arie, Janet (album), Kobato, Lovestrong, Mad Love (JoJo album), Melody (Japanese singer), Moon (visual novel), Shakira (album), The Goods: Live Hard, Sell Hard, and Okay (album). —BarrelProof (talk) 18:09, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

• Support just a Japanese stylism, not used in quality English sources. In ictu oculi (talk) 21:01, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

• Support, periods shouldn't belong at the end of album names. 2601:8C:4001:DCB9:8A8:D1E2:1634:DCC (talk) 04:12, 4 July 2017 (UTC)

• Support. Stylistic flourishe's that cause confusion. are not desired. —  AjaxSmack  21:36, 5 July 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

German release MV and UK/US versions

The German release features the music video for Saku, not Dead Tree. Sources: I own a copy and can confirm, furthermore here's its respective Discogs entry: https://www.discogs.com/de/release/1185478-Dir-En-Grey-Withering-To-Death None of the other entries list any version containing Dead Tree, although a PV definitely exists.

According to the German wiki page, only the UK and US versions feature the five clips of Merciless Cult (live), Final (PV), Machiavellism (live), Saku (PV), Tour04 the Code of Vulgar(ism) (live).

A UK version is missing on Discogs altogether, but it is confirmed the US version has them. https://www.discogs.com/de/release/1643782-Dir-En-Grey-Withering-To-Death 2A02:8071:7150:90E0:FC8D:576A:25F2:4FFB (talk) 21:23, 20 November 2023 (UTC)