Talk:Macapuno

Requested move 27 March 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved, to Macapuno. —usernamekiran(talk) 19:46, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

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Kopyor coconut → Coconut sport – English name, since the subject has multiple names in different languages. Move over redirect  OBSIDIAN†SOUL 09:03, 27 March 2019 (UTC) --Relisting.  — Amakuru (talk) 12:50, 4 April 2019 (UTC)

This is a contested technical request (permalink). Anthony Appleyard (talk) 15:01, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

• @Obsidian Soul: Or move to what? "Coconut sport" sounds like "a sport (game or competition) involving coconuts". Anthony Appleyard (talk) 15:03, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

• @Anthony Appleyard: Coconut mutations or coconut mutants might also be a good general article name, since it can include other types of mutations like Multiple Spicata Coconuts and others. For this specific mutation though, "Coconut sport" is the only one I know that is fully English, though it bears mentioning that "Macapuno" (the Filipino term, also used in Philippine English vs. native makapuno) was the name the mutation was first reported in scientific literature ([1] [2]), and thus may also be viable as the main article title.-- OBSIDIAN†SOUL 21:28, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

I agree "coconut sport" sounds confusing. Plus that can't be the most common name if a kopyor coconut is a coconut sport. Honestly, in the US I've only heard makapuno. --Nessie (talk) 12:26, 28 March 2019 (UTC)

Not sure if they are the same mutations or independent novel mutations with the same results. The issue isn't the most common name though, but the most neutral one. Kopyor is unrecognizable to anyone outside of Indonesia and Malaysia. There are also other names like Kathi in Thailand, Dikiri Pol in Sri Lanka, Thairu Thengai in India, and so on. Coconut sport is the only specific English name that I know of that is actually used in scientific literature, from "sport" - an old synonym of "mutant".

However, I am also leaning towards the Macapuno title, again because it was the name given to the mutation when it was first scientifically described in the Philippines. It was then an American colony, hence why its usage survives in both the Philippines and the US, and is thus technically English. It is used in more international sources, as opposed to "kopyor" which is mostly restricted to Indonesian papers.

The modern cultivation and in vitro propagation of Macapuno was also discovered by Emerita de Guzman, a Filipina scientist, which is why the first major producer of macapuno was the Philippines. Prior to that, macapuno could not be mass-produced as the seeds are sterile, instead they were propagated via the planting of the normal coconuts borne with the mutant coconut in the slim hopes of repeating the mutation.

That said, I am Filipino. So it may be my bias speaking.-- OBSIDIAN†SOUL 22:00, 28 March 2019 (UTC)

I support a move to macapuno. Pinoy English is English. Plus all you just said.--Nessie (talk) 02:21, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

• Move to macapuno as this is stated above and not contradicted to be the more common of the recognisable names. Fascinating topic. Andrewa (talk) 11:02, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
• Move to macapuno or leave as is. Sport will confuse all non botanists. In ictu oculi (talk)
• Move to macapuno. I'm familiar with that name, having seen it in markets in the United States (one brand has the subheading "gelatinous mutant coconut"). en.wiki gets more pageviews from the Philippines than from Indonesia. Plantdrew (talk) 16:19, 4 April 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

To add to article

Basic information to add to this article: why it's called coconut "sport." 98.123.38.211 (talk) 22:05, 17 November 2024 (UTC)

I've added a little, but I think this is one of those cases of a word being used more loosely in general than in botany. Sminthopsis84 (talk) 21:21, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

Major problem: Conflating Macapuno and Kopyor

I was not involved in this article being moved, but to be clear "Kopyor" is not a synonym to Macapuno, as talked about here. Kopyor notably has a "brittle solid endosperm", which is dramatically different from Macapuno whose defining feature is it's gloopy, gel-like endosperm. Unfortunately, as it is, this article repeatedly mentions Kopyor without ever introducing the word and then treats them as synonyms, leading to a lot of incorrect information about Macapuno in an article about Macapuno.

This page doesn't just need a minor edit, which I could do, it needs an almost complete overhaul that removes every mention of Kopyor (Unless this article becomes about Coconut Sports specifically, including both Macapuno and Kopyor) and replaces that information with correct information about Macapuno. Making it more difficult is that both sports are obviously still biologically Cocos Nucifera so great caution needs to be taken when adding information from sources. And of course, the confusion between if these sports are the same also will make it more difficult because a lot of the information on the internet doesn't make a distinction between Macapuno and Kopyor either. This is, unfortunately, way above my head. Tinilmambor (talk) 01:56, 18 November 2024 (UTC)