Talk:Kiryas Joel–Poughkeepsie–Newburgh metropolitan area

Arlington's inclusion in the lead

Arlington, a hamlet, though of considerable population, is not and can not be listed as a "principal city of", "anchor of", or anything of importance for this MSA. It is a hamlet. This is an article about an MSA, a construct of the census bureau, which does not recognize hamlets. Arlington is a CDP, which is not the same as a hamlet, and even should the wording be replaced to correctly list Arlington as a CDP that does not make it important as the three cores of the MSA, the Census Bureau does not recognize the CDP of Arlington as any more important than any other hamlet, CDP, town, village or city; but does recognize Poughkeepsie, Newburgh, and Middletown as the three core cities that they use for the defintion of what can be included as part of the MSA. The census doesnt just pick cities by random, the three cities listed are used every decade to decide what counties are to be included in the MSA by how the county's non-farm employed workers commute to or from those cities and the counties those cities are in, the cities are chosen first, the counties second. Arlington is not used to decide what counties are in the MSA, Arlington has no special place in this MSA, nor is it large enough population-wise to even be a core city for a MSA even if it were legally a city. Arlington's inclusion in the lead has always been about self-promoting localism regarding Arlington.Camelbinky (talk) 17:47, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Each MSA has a list of "principal cities" defined by the Office of Management and Budget. Arlington CDP is indeed on that list. --Polaron | Talk 18:50, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

May I see this OMB list? Do you have a link? The fact that Arlington is not a city and not in the title is why it is not a "principal city", why I stated above is how the Census Bureau decides on MSA boundaries based on the true principal cities, which must be of a certain size, and Arlington is not of that size. I stick by my statements. Sorry. And if you are going to refer to a CDP then refer to it as such in an article, hamlet and CDP are not interchangeable.Camelbinky (talk) 21:48, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Chairs

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Kiryas Joel wrongly added

Kiryas Joel is not a major city in the metropolitan area. This must be changed permanently. 96.249.222.206 (talk) 20:04, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

It was a decision made by the White House, see page 22 (PDF page 25) of OMB Bulletin No 23-01. If you think it is wrong, you need to take it up with them, not here. Also, it is kind of obvious why they did it – in the 2020 census, KJ's population was bigger than Poughkeepsie or Newburgh or Middletown; the standard practice is the MSA is named after its largest population centers, since KJ is its largest population center, it has to go in the MSA name. SomethingForDeletion (talk) 19:57, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

Building a slum and putting thousands of people on top of each other that constantly pop out babies doesn't make it a city. 96.249.216.148 (talk) 03:30, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

The US federal government officially classifies it as being a "city". See page numbered 58 (PDF page 61) of OMB Bulletin 23-01, which says:

28880 Kiryas Joel-Poughkeepsie-Newburgh, NY Metropolitan Statistical Area

Principal Cities: Kiryas Joel, Poughkeepsie, Newburgh, Woodbury

Dutchess County, Orange County

As I said, if you don't agree, you need to complain to the White House, not here. SomethingForDeletion (talk) 07:11, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

Like I said. It's not a city. People do not commute there. It's a religious town that has no standing in the region. 96.249.216.148 (talk) 00:21, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

It is a "city" according to the White House. On Wikipedia, we have a saying "Verifiability, not truth". That means, the most important thing is not that what an article says is "true", it is that it is supported by reliable sources. OMB Bulletin 23-01 is an official US government source, issued by the White House, which calls Kiryas Joel a "principal city" of this metro area. You may think the White House made a mistake here, but for Wikipedia, the most important thing is to go by what the official document says (unless you can cite some other source you think should take precedence over it), even if you think the document is wrong. SomethingForDeletion (talk) 03:01, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

The White House is run by a bunch of idiots. I live here. It's not a city, it's a religious cult town that treats outsiders like enemies

. It should have never been called a city and it definitely should not be named in the M anything but a villageSA. It's not even close to Poughkeepsie or Newburgh which are actual cities. 96.249.216.148 (talk) 13:41, 8 April 2024 (UTC)