Talk:Human safari (terror campaign)
Latest comment: 12 days ago by Vpab15 in topic Requested move 22 November 2024
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 | On 22 November 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved. The result of the discussion was moved to Human safari (terror campaign). |
Requested move 22 November 2024
edit- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The result of the move request was: moved to Human safari (terror campaign). Consensus to move the article to Human safari (terror campaign) and redirect Human safari to Human zoo. (closed by non-admin page mover) Vpab15 (talk) 20:12, 9 December 2024 (UTC)
Human safari → ? – W4r5a7w4r blanked and redirected this page to Human zoo. I reverted the blanking, since the subject of this article seems notable, but I agree that it doesn't seem to be the primary topic of the term "human safari". jlwoodwa (talk) 03:20, 22 November 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. —CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {C•X}) 18:19, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
- Wiktionary (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/human_safari) unambiguously defines the term "human safari" as a synonym of "human zoo". It doesn't define any other meanings of this term. So by WP:D2D Human safari should be either a redirect to Human zoo, or a disambiguation page. W4r5a7w4r (talk) 03:45, 22 November 2024 (UTC)
- By the way, in case someone doubts the definition given in Wiktionary, here are more definitions in the dictionaries, that are not Wiki sister projects and are not dependent on volunteer editing:
- "an organized tour that takes tourists to unfamiliar places where they can observe the lifestyle of Indigenous or other local people" (https://www.dictionary.com/browse/human-safari),
- "a trip in which tourists can glimpse indigenous peoples" (https://dictionaryblog.cambridge.org/2012/08/20/new-words-20-august-2012/).
- Human zoos made of indigenous people for travellers delight.
- But even now there are some editors who seek to censor this humiliation and suffering from history by hijacking this page just for fun. It's shameful. W4r5a7w4r (talk) 19:59, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
- @W4r5a7w4r: Please assume good faith – I don't think anybody here is trying to censor things, let alone "for fun". The subject of this article has been referred to as a "human safari", so I hope you can see why someone honestly thought that was the best title for the article, even if you disagree.If you want the title Human safari to redirect to Human zoo, then before that can happen, the existing article at that title must be moved elsewhere. That's why I started this discussion. jlwoodwa (talk) 23:34, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
- Well, I hope you are right and the page about the term used to describe 200-year-old European colonial practice, that preceded not only Russo-Ukrainian War, but also contemporary Russia/Ukraine, will not be classified as WP:RUSUKR, because it's completely and utterly ridiculous. W4r5a7w4r (talk) 02:24, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
- Since despite being a "new" editor you clearly have an understanding about Wikipedia guidelines I would think you would be familiar with WP:AGF, I'm not trying to censor anything, the only thing close to censorship here has been your removal of the term "terror" and purposeful nature of attacks on civilians, despite this clearly being in the sources, replacing it with your own WP:OR referring to strikes on civilians as a "military campaign", which you still haven't explained.
- It doesn't exactly make it look better when your sole other focus (with this account) has been on another WP:RUSUKR article, Vladimir Bukovsky, where your edits include changing a section title "Russian agents in the European Union" to "Criticism of the European Union". But this might be a matter for WP:AN/I. TylerBurden (talk) 17:04, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
- Well, I hope you are right and the page about the term used to describe 200-year-old European colonial practice, that preceded not only Russo-Ukrainian War, but also contemporary Russia/Ukraine, will not be classified as WP:RUSUKR, because it's completely and utterly ridiculous. W4r5a7w4r (talk) 02:24, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
- @W4r5a7w4r: Please assume good faith – I don't think anybody here is trying to censor things, let alone "for fun". The subject of this article has been referred to as a "human safari", so I hope you can see why someone honestly thought that was the best title for the article, even if you disagree.If you want the title Human safari to redirect to Human zoo, then before that can happen, the existing article at that title must be moved elsewhere. That's why I started this discussion. jlwoodwa (talk) 23:34, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
- Wiktionary (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/human_safari) unambiguously defines the term "human safari" as a synonym of "human zoo". It doesn't define any other meanings of this term. So by WP:D2D Human safari should be either a redirect to Human zoo, or a disambiguation page. W4r5a7w4r (talk) 03:45, 22 November 2024 (UTC)
- Move to
Human safari (military campaign)Human safari (terror campaign). Human safari should WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT to human zoo. Theparties (talk) 03:53, 22 November 2024 (UTC)- Human safari (terror campaign) is more in line with sources—blindlynx 19:37, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
- Yes, strongly opposed to "military campaign", this is WP:OR, none of the sources refer to it as such, probably because for it to be a military campaign they would need to be targeting military targets and not civilians. Forbes explicitly calls it a terror campaign. So if a move is to be made then this would be far more appropriate. TylerBurden (talk) 19:46, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
- i think a dab and hatnotes on this and human zoo is an appropriate course of action, but 'military campaign' is not a good dab—blindlynx 19:57, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
- Yes, strongly opposed to "military campaign", this is WP:OR, none of the sources refer to it as such, probably because for it to be a military campaign they would need to be targeting military targets and not civilians. Forbes explicitly calls it a terror campaign. So if a move is to be made then this would be far more appropriate. TylerBurden (talk) 19:46, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
- Human safari (terror campaign) is more in line with sources—blindlynx 19:37, 2 December 2024 (UTC)
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- How about something along the lines of "Russian drone attacks against Ukrainian civilians during the Russia-Ukraine War"? JayCubby Talk 22:57, 22 November 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: Ok so bear with me here since I'm by no means well versed in title conventions beyond the basics, but from what I understand the issue is human safari not being WP:PRIMARY. Given that this term has only recently surfaced in WP:RS, I do not understand arguments such as it not appearing on Wiktionary, a sister project as dependent on volunteer editing as this one. The more valid concern seems to be the conflation of ″human safari″ and ″human zoo″.
- The non extended-confirmed editor that initiated this issue in the first place's accusation of the term being my own ″WP:OR″ is nonsense, all of the cited references on the article refer to this specific occurrence as ″human safari″. But given how their alterations to the article itself did not reflect these sources, I guess it is not surprising that this was either missed or purposefully ignored in order to make this accusation. So we have a drove of reliable sources (more can also be found) using this term to specifically refer to the Russian hunting of civilians in Kherson.
- Wouldn't the logical thing to do then be to distinguish the articles by adding a ″for other uses″ as is normally done when two similar sounding topics might be confused? So on this article it would be ″for displays of people, see Human zoo″ and vice versa. This would solve the problem of distinguishing between the two without impacting either article significantly. --TylerBurden (talk) 18:27, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
- The current barbarity should remain 'Human Safari', as that is what those suffering through it dubbed it. It accurately portrays the current events, the callous cruelty of russians and the "Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom" spectator nature of the Free World. There is no better term.
- Moving it to 'Human Zoo' has it's own connotations that will not serve anyone seeking the truth, but will serve those seeking to inflict cruelty. And it will not change how the innocent being hunted feel about it or refer to it. PsychotropicDog (talk) 12:02, 27 November 2024 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.